I have a Black Box that when selecting any number past 136 it picks up the wrong selection. All the 200's work fine. I replaced the box with another one in the juke and that one worked fine. There used to be a guy in Canada that repaired them and I can't find his info. -- Paul Howlett Pinball Paul's 703-361-0420
On 2023/08/07 11:28 a.m., Paul Howlett via Jukebox-list wrote:
I have a Black Box that when selecting any number past 136 it picks up the wrong selection. All the 200's work fine. I replaced the box with another one in the juke and that one worked fine. There used to be a guy in Canada that repaired them and I can't find his info.
Hi Paul, That might be me you are thinking of. I am in BC...we have the test gear for the grey and Black boxes. Before sending the Black Box (and grey box too for verification if you wish) to my shop (address below) I recommend you first look at the AMP pins in the connectors to that box and make sure they are all of a similar height within the connector to engage firmly with the card edge connector of the internal PCB. I use a dental pick/probe to pull them up if they are down a bit... John :-#)# -- John's Jukes Ltd. 7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3 Call (604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
I have Tony Miller's book and from what I read the "D" one shot is not working. Does anyone have a cross for those transistors 6309? On Mon, Aug 7, 2023 at 2:45 PM John Robertson via Jukebox-list < jukebox-list@lists.netlojix.com> wrote:
On 2023/08/07 11:28 a.m., Paul Howlett via Jukebox-list wrote:
I have a Black Box that when selecting any number past 136 it picks up the wrong selection. All the 200's work fine. I replaced the box with another one in the juke and that one worked fine. There used to be a guy in Canada that repaired them and I can't find his info.
Hi Paul,
That might be me you are thinking of. I am in BC...we have the test gear for the grey and Black boxes.
Before sending the Black Box (and grey box too for verification if you wish) to my shop (address below) I recommend you first look at the AMP pins in the connectors to that box and make sure they are all of a similar height within the connector to engage firmly with the card edge connector of the internal PCB. I use a dental pick/probe to pull them up if they are down a bit...
John :-#)#
-- John's Jukes Ltd. 7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3 Call (604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
_______________________________________________ Jukebox-list mailing list -- jukebox-list@lists.netlojix.com To unsubscribe send an email to jukebox-list-leave@lists.netlojix.com %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s Searchable Archives: http://jukebox.markmail.org/
-- Paul Howlett Pinball Paul's 703-361-0420
On 2023/08/08 1:34 p.m., Paul Howlett wrote:
I have Tony Miller's book and from what I read the "D" one shot is not working. Does anyone have a cross for those transistors 6309?
This is the list of cross-references I've compiled from a few sources: https://www.flippers.com/seeburgx.html John :-#)#
On Mon, Aug 7, 2023 at 2:45 PM John Robertson via Jukebox-list <jukebox-list@lists.netlojix.com> wrote:
On 2023/08/07 11:28 a.m., Paul Howlett via Jukebox-list wrote: > I have a Black Box that when selecting any number past 136 it picks up the > wrong selection. All the 200's work fine. I replaced the box with another > one in the juke and that one worked fine. There used to be a guy in Canada > that repaired them and I can't find his info.
Hi Paul,
That might be me you are thinking of. I am in BC...we have the test gear for the grey and Black boxes.
Before sending the Black Box (and grey box too for verification if you wish) to my shop (address below) I recommend you first look at the AMP pins in the connectors to that box and make sure they are all of a similar height within the connector to engage firmly with the card edge connector of the internal PCB. I use a dental pick/probe to pull them up if they are down a bit...
John :-#)#
-- John's Jukes Ltd. 7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3 Call (604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) flippers.com <http://flippers.com> "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
_______________________________________________ Jukebox-list mailing list -- jukebox-list@lists.netlojix.com To unsubscribe send an email to jukebox-list-leave@lists.netlojix.com %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s Searchable Archives: http://jukebox.markmail.org/
-- Paul Howlett Pinball Paul's
703-361-0420
-- John's Jukes Ltd. 7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3 Call (604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
On 8/8/23 13:34, Paul Howlett via Jukebox-list wrote:
I have Tony Miller's book and from what I read the "D" one shot is not working. Does anyone have a cross for those transistors 6309?
Fairchild FS36309, PNP silicon TO-92 case. 2N5366 or PN2907 will substitute. -- Jay Hennigan - jay@west.net Network Engineering - CCIE #7880 503 897-8550 - WB6RDV
On 2023/08/08 10:02 p.m., Jay Hennigan via Jukebox-list wrote:
On 8/8/23 13:34, Paul Howlett via Jukebox-list wrote:
I have Tony Miller's book and from what I read the "D" one shot is not working. Does anyone have a cross for those transistors 6309?
Fairchild FS36309, PNP silicon TO-92 case. 2N5366 or PN2907 will substitute.
Thanks Jay, I've updated my cross-reference page with that info! Assuming the 6309 isn't actually a data code that is! John :-#)# -- John's Jukes Ltd. 7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3 Call (604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
On 8/8/23 22:46, John Robertson via Jukebox-list wrote:
On 2023/08/08 10:02 p.m., Jay Hennigan via Jukebox-list wrote:
On 8/8/23 13:34, Paul Howlett via Jukebox-list wrote:
I have Tony Miller's book and from what I read the "D" one shot is not working. Does anyone have a cross for those transistors 6309?
Fairchild FS36309, PNP silicon TO-92 case. 2N5366 or PN2907 will substitute.
Thanks Jay, I've updated my cross-reference page with that info!
Assuming the 6309 isn't actually a data code that is!
I derived it from data on your https://www.flippers.com/seeburgx.html page. :-) Your link to the HAP reference shows marking 6309 on the part as being a Seeburg 309460. Page 17 of that document shows (handwritten) a Fairchild F36309 house number, note that the last four digits match those on the part. It lists 2N5366 as the JEDEC number. As many smaller parts houses don't carry a lot of 2N.... parts, I looked up a couple of my go-to substitutions and found that the PN2907 (TO-92 package of the pricey metal case 2N2907) has similar voltage and gain specs and a higher current rating so will drop right in and is more likely to be available at smaller suppliers. Mouser had both the 2N5366 and the PN2907 at under a dollar. Unless it really needs to switch 300ma, any small-signal PNP transistor should do the trick. I tend to avoid the NTE series as they're usually much more expensive. If you're buying from Mouser or Digikey, get several PN2222 and PN2907 transistors as well as a handful of 2N3904 and 2N3906. The PN2222 and 2N3904 are boys and the PN2907 and 2N3906 are girls. Pretty much universal small signal transistor substitutes. with the PN being higher current for switching and the 3904/3906 better for amplifiers. -- Jay Hennigan - jay@west.net Network Engineering - CCIE #7880 503 897-8550 - WB6RDV
On 8/9/2023 2:23 PM, Jay Hennigan via Jukebox-list wrote:
I tend to avoid the NTE series as they're usually much more expensive.
I had heard that NTE parts are stripped of the original numbers and re-numbered with their number. Especially true for some of the very hard to find older parts, they find a stash and buy them up. Or they use a compatible substitutes and mark it with their numbers. I had once purchased some of the NTE 102 geraniums and they crackled like they were 50 years old. The newer parts, they could most likely have them made off a different brand manufacturer, but branded with the NTE numbers. Either way, I've never seen comparable NTE parts that weren't more expensive than others, and you don't really know what you are getting.
On 2023/08/10 3:47 a.m., Tony Miklos via Jukebox-list wrote:
On 8/9/2023 2:23 PM, Jay Hennigan via Jukebox-list wrote:
I tend to avoid the NTE series as they're usually much more expensive.
I had heard that NTE parts are stripped of the original numbers and re-numbered with their number. Especially true for some of the very hard to find older parts, they find a stash and buy them up. Or they use a compatible substitutes and mark it with their numbers. I had once purchased some of the NTE 102 geraniums and they crackled like they were 50 years old.
The newer parts, they could most likely have them made off a different brand manufacturer, but branded with the NTE numbers.
Either way, I've never seen comparable NTE parts that weren't more expensive than others, and you don't really know what you are getting.
ECG --> TCG --> NTE are basically renumbered stock parts. I have a page on those cross-references here: https://flippers.com/X-Ref-ECG.html John :-#)# -- John's Jukes Ltd. 7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3 Call (604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
Tony, you are correct. This is taken directly from their website: "Manufacturing Disclaimer Products labeled with the trademarks of NTE Electronics Inc., including NTE and ECG products, may originate from various suppliers and intermediate sources, and in some cases products are inspected and re-labeled by NTE Electronics Inc. NTE products are not suggested for use in the Medical, Military, Defense or Aerospace industries." Andrew -----Original Message----- From: Tony Miklos via Jukebox-list <jukebox-list@lists.netlojix.com> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2023 3:47 AM To: jukebox-list@lists.netlojix.com Cc: Tony Miklos <jukeboxandpinball@gmail.com> Subject: [Jukebox-list] Re: Black Box issue On 8/9/2023 2:23 PM, Jay Hennigan via Jukebox-list wrote:
I tend to avoid the NTE series as they're usually much more expensive.
I had heard that NTE parts are stripped of the original numbers and re-numbered with their number. Especially true for some of the very hard to find older parts, they find a stash and buy them up. Or they use a compatible substitutes and mark it with their numbers. I had once purchased some of the NTE 102 geraniums and they crackled like they were 50 years old. The newer parts, they could most likely have them made off a different brand manufacturer, but branded with the NTE numbers. Either way, I've never seen comparable NTE parts that weren't more expensive than others, and you don't really know what you are getting. _______________________________________________ Jukebox-list mailing list -- jukebox-list@lists.netlojix.com To unsubscribe send an email to jukebox-list-leave@lists.netlojix.com %(web_page_url)slistinfo%(cgiext)s/%(_internal_name)s Searchable Archives: http://jukebox.markmail.org/
On 8/10/2023 1:18 PM, Andrew Burkhart via Jukebox-list wrote:
Tony, you are correct. This is taken directly from their website:
"Manufacturing Disclaimer
Products labeled with the trademarks of NTE Electronics Inc., including NTE and ECG products, may originate from various suppliers and intermediate sources, and in some cases products are inspected and re-labeled by NTE Electronics Inc.
NTE products are not suggested for use in the Medical, Military, Defense or Aerospace industries."
Andrew
-----Original Message----- From: Tony Miklos via Jukebox-list <jukebox-list@lists.netlojix.com> Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2023 3:47 AM To: jukebox-list@lists.netlojix.com Cc: Tony Miklos <jukeboxandpinball@gmail.com> Subject: [Jukebox-list] Re: Black Box issue
On 8/9/2023 2:23 PM, Jay Hennigan via Jukebox-list wrote:
I tend to avoid the NTE series as they're usually much more expensive. I had heard that NTE parts are stripped of the original numbers and re-numbered with their number. Especially true for some of the very hard to find older parts, they find a stash and buy them up. Or they use a compatible substitutes and mark it with their numbers. I had once purchased some of the NTE 102 geraniums and they crackled like they were 50 years old.
Ahh, that was supposed to say "germanium" not "geranium". Been a while since I ordered any flowers. ;) Also, I didn't know ECG was still in business. But they did/do the same as NTE.
On 2023/08/09 11:23 a.m., Jay Hennigan via Jukebox-list wrote:
On 8/8/23 22:46, John Robertson via Jukebox-list wrote:
On 2023/08/08 10:02 p.m., Jay Hennigan via Jukebox-list wrote:
On 8/8/23 13:34, Paul Howlett via Jukebox-list wrote:
I have Tony Miller's book and from what I read the "D" one shot is not working. Does anyone have a cross for those transistors 6309?
Fairchild FS36309, PNP silicon TO-92 case. 2N5366 or PN2907 will substitute.
Thanks Jay, I've updated my cross-reference page with that info!
Assuming the 6309 isn't actually a data code that is!
I derived it from data on your https://www.flippers.com/seeburgx.html page. :-) Your link to the HAP reference shows marking 6309 on the part as being a Seeburg 309460. Page 17 of that document shows (handwritten) a Fairchild F36309 house number, note that the last four digits match those on the part. It lists 2N5366 as the JEDEC number. As many smaller parts houses don't carry a lot of 2N.... parts, I looked up a couple of my go-to substitutions and found that the PN2907 (TO-92 package of the pricey metal case 2N2907) has similar voltage and gain specs and a higher current rating so will drop right in and is more likely to be available at smaller suppliers. Mouser had both the 2N5366 and the PN2907 at under a dollar.
Ah, I should have consulted my notes! Thanks, John :-#)#
Unless it really needs to switch 300ma, any small-signal PNP transistor should do the trick. I tend to avoid the NTE series as they're usually much more expensive.
If you're buying from Mouser or Digikey, get several PN2222 and PN2907 transistors as well as a handful of 2N3904 and 2N3906. The PN2222 and 2N3904 are boys and the PN2907 and 2N3906 are girls. Pretty much universal small signal transistor substitutes. with the PN being higher current for switching and the 3904/3906 better for amplifiers.
-- John's Jukes Ltd. 7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3 Call (604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out"
participants (5)
-
Andrew Burkhart -
Jay Hennigan -
John Robertson -
Paul Howlett -
Tony Miklos